Occupy (Insert Location Here)

Have any of you seen this? I know DStahzz has because he posted an article on facebook regarding it. Here is the NY Times article he posted [link]

I had not heard of it until I saw some pages on facebook on Monday. A few people liking the pages "Occupy Louisville" and "Occupy Kentucky"

Apparently it started as 'Occupy Wall Street'

Occupy Louisville had just 3 people liking it when I saw it around 2 or 3 pm. It is now up to 1,605. They are planning a "protest" Tuesday. I use the quotation marks because I can't call it a real protest since there is no specific goal. A protest is not going to stop joblessness.

I left this comment on their page:

"What is the point of this protest? There are 9 PROPOSED goals. The point of a protest is to get media attention for a certain goal so that it is recognized and, hopefully, remedied. When you have people that are just showing up at a "protest" without a clearly defined set of goals it just looks unorganized and won't be taken seriously.

It is going to look really bad when a news station shows up and someone there simply repeats, "Bring back the Glass-Steagall Act!" Then the news station asks them why or how they feel that would help the situation and that person has no idea what the Glass-Steagall Act is or no solutions other than vague goals. Which will just discredit the protest even more and have people writing it off as "whinny kids""


He are links provided to convince people that their cause, whatever it may be, is just:

Email: OccupyLouisville@gmail.com

Twitter: https://twitter.com/occupylou

DETAILED LIST OF PROPOSED DEMANDS:
https://occupywallst.org/forum/detailed-lis...-tactics-for-d/

http://occupywallst.org/ (News and Logistics)

http://occupytogether.org/ (Regional Occupations)

http://nycga.cc/ (NYC General Assembly)


Any simple google search can give you links to supporters and detractors.

What, if any, opinions do you have on this? I believe it is a noble cause but it takes much more than a group of people showing up that have no idea what they are protesting for. I, or many people, can't take something seriously when no one knows what they're standing up for in the first place.

It's sort of like the Tea Party, only a lot less intellectual and they can't decide whether they are wacko liberals or wacko conservatives.

They've done some good in exposing abuse of power by police forces, but other than that they do just seem to be whining without offering solutions - and they seem to scapegoat the wrong guys as well.

They need to STFU and go occupy a JOB. Seriously, for the six or so intelligent, serious "occupy" protestors, they must look around and see all their hot topic wearing wackos and feel like idiots. They're attracting a lot of the clueless morons who don't know what they're protesting, but showed up to "stick it to the man." They lack a clear vision, specific goals, and a plan for acheiving the goals (or if they have all that, they're not good at getting it out). I know we have plenty of problems in this country, but attacking corporations and rich people is not the damn answer.

Honestly, this is indicative of how pathetically incapable of independent thought that some of the population is. Most of the "occupy" idiots (that is, the ones that aren't paid plants to try and make the movement look more legit than it is) don't even know what they're protesting and don't understand economics, government, or business in the slightest. The vast majority have merely hopped on the bandwagon of scattered ridiculous ideas, which as far as I can glean from their various garbled manifestos, can be summarized as follows:

1) Anyone who is rich is inherently evil, and it's unfair that they have more money.
2) Capitalism is why our economy sucks, even though it's how America was built.
3) Every corporation is bad and has a CEO who is greedy and should be fired.
4) We should get paid for simply being alive, rather than for doing any actual work.
5) When people spend more than they have and rack up debt, it's the banks' fault.

And while they have somewhat "exposed abuse of power" by police, I'd be willing to bet that for every protester who actually didn't do anything wrong and was wrongly detained or beaten or whatever, there are two who are breaking laws and/or forcing police to take action. I further realize that some cell phone video some protestor takes of police clubbing some other protester over the head doesn't necessarily represent the situation, depending on what happened prior to when the cameras started rolling or during the unedited footage. There are always idiots in these sorts of things who go out of their way to try and provoke the police in the hopes they can get police to abuse their power or make it look like they are to try and "stick it to the man".

That being said, some of this movement isn't entirely off point. There are some decent points raised here and there, like ending corruption in the SEC, removing some loopholes in tax structure (though that should go for ALL tax structure, not just against corporations and the wealthy), disallowing or capping bonuses for executives of companies which are declining and/or accepting bailouts, etc. And then there's complete idiocy like this that's completely radical, unreasonable, and nonsensical.

That's the problem with this whole thing. The few good ideas that exist are diluted by lots of dumb that overwhelms them, and the organization of the movement (or lack thereof) is laughable. It's just a collection of people with random qualms, and their respective "I want" lists are all over the map. Which is probably why there is no "official" list of demands, because they can't even agree on what it is they want, nor would they have any idea on how to implement it if they did. The biggest issue I have with the whole movement is that no one seems to think big-picture on any of this. Some ideas that sound great for a particular area in theory would have enormous negative implications in practice that seem to not be considered whatsoever. Economies are a highly complex, interdependent web of industries in both public and private sectors with an impossible number of factors, so effects of any significant change are often very widespread, and few seem to have figured that out.

The concept of "demands" here is pretty funny in a sad kind of way, though. Demand implies leverage. What are you going to do if you don't get your way, protesters? Continue NOT producing? Gee, we're scared. Odds are that if you've got the time to stand around and whine for the better part of a month, you're not exactly a key contributor to our economy. I would freaking love it if about a few dozen protesters were collected at random, and then demographic information was released about their respective occupations, income levels, etc. I guarantee that most would be heavily reliant on the government teat, and few, if any, would be contributing more than they take as a U.S. citizen.

And enough of this bank scapegoating. Stricter government regulations have been enacted to hamstring banks after they became the go-to "bad guy" for the financial downturn, which pretty much misses the mark anyway by punishing your local branch instead of the crooks in the SEC who misrated junk bonds along with the scattered Wall St execs who were in on it. And let's not forget that individuals defaulting on loans en masse was required for the bottom to fall out. There was plenty of blame to go around for that whole disaster, but the banks have gotten damn near the entirety of it. A bunch of these same morons who were willfully living beyond their means to default on loans continue to refuse to point the finger in the mirror for their part, and I'm taking a wild guess that they're all about this "occupy" movement since it removes accountability from their behavior.

All in all, this movement is probably doing more harm than good. I don't figure it changes much for society's leeches to be protesting because they wouldn't be producing either way, but the possibility of this loser mentality of blaming the world for personal failures pervading the working class is a scary thought. It's a microcosm of the much larger problem, which is that personal responsibility has flown out the f***ing window because people are becoming increasingly selfish, lazy, and stupid. That's the socialist way, and history proves that it doesn't work. Capitalism works, provided people work. Except our wonderful government deincentivizes actual work by offering a multitude of handouts. The biggest irony is that the dregs of society have been receiving the equivalent of a bailout for years. Let's talk about the 9% receiving unemployment benefits. Or the 9% on welfare. I'm the 91% who actually contributes and has to pay for this crap to pick up their slack. You're welcome, you worthless asshole protesters. The least you could do for us producers is STFU.

Damn, Tech, that is one of the best political rants I've read in awhile. Good job.

Sounds about right from the quotes I'm hearing from these guys. One girl was pissed that her bank decided to start charging her just to have a debit card (which is admittedly a douchey policy), but she was whining that is unfair because she didn't agree to it when she signed up and implied that the government should do something about it? Wtf? It's not "unfair" - they changed the terms they were willing to agree to, and if you don't agree, then the deal is off. The real irony is she added "I switched to a credit union and I'm much happier with them" - hurray, you get how the free market works! You don't need to sit around and occupy anything, because you don't have a problem to complain about because you already fixed the problem yourself by switching a competitor with a better policy.

A lot of the "unethical bank" stuff was forced on banks by the government in the first place. Which is proof of the exact opposite of the Occupy creed - "we need to change the government to get new people in power who will regulate these corrupt rich people and companies to help out the little guy". The subprime mortgage crises largely happened because the government was attempting to force banks to help out the little guy!

"Corrupt" seems to be their favorite buzzword. They keep using that word, but I do not think it means what they think it means.

I don't really care for upcoming debit card fees, either, because I love my debit card, but it's not as douchey as most think. Banks developed the technology and infrastructure necessary for debit cards to exist in the first place at great cost to them to the direct benefit of both consumers and retailers. (Not that it was entirely altruistic; it helped reduce some of their overhead once in place.) And debit card users have been enjoying virtually all the benefits of a check or credit card without any of the inconveniences and costs for years. I don't even have a credit card or checkbook for this very reason. Now, these fees are finally being enacted, but it's a direct result of the hamstrung margins from banks having to jump through the new government hoops. Which is one of the unforeseen consequences I alluded to earlier. The same morons that cheered the new government policies that stick it to the mean ol' banks are whining now because it has come back around. News flash, that's how sh*t works. Except everyone wants to have their cake and eat it, too. I don't like the debit card fees, but I get why they exist, so you won't hear me bitching.

On another note, I got curious last night about what kind of person writes something as dumb as what I linked. What I found about this "Lloyd Hart" was exactly what I expected. He wants other people to buy him a new computer because he's broke, facebook is apparently trying to keep him down, he founded a website about electing pro-weed politicians, etc., etc. Think of every possible stereotype you can about a protester, and this clown is that and then some. Stupid hippies like this ruin any chance the "occupy" movement has of gaining credibility or accomplishing anything positive at all. And just for fun, I'm going to address his sad little list of "demands".

Get paid for doing nothing! Woo! And that $20/hr minimum wage will be great for small business. I guess he wants only large corporations to be able to stay afloat.

Really? That's the only effect private insurers have? Look into the concept of medical research sometime. Oh, and as for "taking money away from doctors, nurses, and hospitals", why don't you try asking them about the wondrous government programs of Medicare and Medicaid? And while you're at it, ask the AMA what supporting Obamacare has done in terms of their membership.

Isn't this the same thing as "demand one"? Pay people who contribute nothing to the economy? Why would anyone work, then?

What a wonderful utopian concept! I'm sure rainbows and unicorns will foot the bill for this.

"Economy" is WHY the fossil fuel consumption continues. Everyone wants an renewable alternative energy source, and much research has gone into trying to find one for some time. At the present time, none of them are particularly viable, economically or otherwise. Forcing some "fast-track" off fossil fuels while the alternative isn't there would be a disaster.

One trillion? Do you think he put his pinky by his mouth when he wrote this? And what's the point? Spending just to spend? Are we going to rebuild every road just to do it? Or put a monorail in Montana? Oh, and then there's that whole "where does this money come from" thing, but don't worry about that.

Yay for another magic trillion. All nuclear power plants? I'm glad this hippie has figured out a better way to produce energy that I'm sure he just forgot to mention. And if he actually wants to reestablish wetlands, he can support Ducks Unlimited like I do. Oh wait, that would require him contributing his money instead of other people's money.

For what purpose? Discrimination laws are already on the books. Ever heard of the EEOC? Actually, in fairness, he may not have, given that it deals with the employed.

And how, exactly, would we force other countries to agree to this? Not to mention that I'm sure there would be no issues with the additional burden of the entire country of Mexico jumping onto the brilliant free living wage, $20 minimum wage, and free college plans.

You mean your hemp party? Stoners can't even count to twenty.

As if the rest of this wasn't dumb enough already, this is just laughable. Great plan, hippie. I'm sure China would be completely on board with forgiving all of that U.S. national debt they bought up. I'm sure the financial industry would be perfectly healthy after taking a loss on the books for every loan out there for everything. I'm sure that this would send a message to everyone that they have to be responsible with their money. Dear God.

And it gets even better. Give that guy who just had all his debt forgiven a mansion on the coastline, please. He's approved, because no one can report that he can't be trusted to repay a penny he borrows. Hey, and when they find out that he can't pay again, let's just forgive his debt again, right?

What would unions have to complain about if everyone is guaranteed a $41,600 minimum salary?

How? The only "demands" that could possibly create jobs are the ecological/infrastructure sections, along with the additional purveyors of red tape with socialized medicine, all of which would get at least ~42k per year, of course. That is, for those people who would actually even work if there were a living wage.

I almost want to call this number, but I've found that it's pretty pointless to try and explain to a stupid person why they're stupid. They'll never get it, and it's sad. And odds are it's not working anyway because I doubt he's paid his phone bill and "the man" at the phone company is keeping him down. I guess his next "demand" will be that other people pay that for him, too.

This post has been edited by TexasTech on Oct 18 2011, 10:35 AM

BINGO. This is one of my biggest complaints about these 'tards. Big evil corporations are making "record profits" (theres another rant about the fallacy of this phrase, but I digress) and therefore they are bad and should give up that money. But where do those profits come from? CONSUMERS. People choose to exchange currency for a good or service. Markets dictate prices and people have the right to decide whether or not to engage in commerce. These idiots clamor for such ideas as "justice" and "freedom" with their not-so-witty signs filled with platitudes...yet when they describe their utopia it sounds a hell of a lot like communism. And as long as the people in power keep playing to the uneducated masses and villafying the "lucky rich people" (while giving them a reach around behind the scenes), real change is unlikely.

In summary: YOU DON'T REPRESENT 99% OF THE POPULATION, ASSCLOWNS.

Dave Ramsey pwns Occupy

Wow, that articulates the way I view OWS very well. I usually can't get past "stupid f'n hippies." Nicely done, Dave!

First, the right wing media makes these people just look like a bunch of burnt out communist hippies. Just like the left wing media makes the Tea Party look like a bunch of gun toting, greedy, racists rednecks.

Anyways, I agree with their general cause. Crony capitalism is clearly a problem in America. Big business is in bed with the government. Which is one of the reasons we are in this economic mess.

There's right wing media? That's news to me! And the OWS people don't need ANY help looking like burnt out communist hippies. The media leans very heavily to the left and even they struggle to show any positive sides of the OWS people. Like I said before, I'm sure there is a small group at the core of OWS that is intelligent and well meaning, but the problem is the nutjobs who protest for the sake of protesting are the vocal majority.

I don't disagree at all that we have problems, but we need them to be specifically outlined. "Crony capitalism" is a fun buzzword, but it's meaningless without specific examples and efforts to change/prevent it from continuing. Same with "big business is in bed with the government." It makes for a good protest sign, but not much else. When company XYZ received an overpriced contract from the government after donating to a campaign, THOSE are the things we need brought to light.

The Tea Party and OWS are more similar than either side would like to admit, but the big difference is in actions taken. The Tea Party has influenced elections and forced its way into the legislature. If OWS can weed out the destructive, entitled morons who think wealth should be "distributed," they might be able to organize and affect change, but unfortunately I don't see that happening.

There are obviously more left wing media outlets than right wing. But the right wing media certainly exists. Fox News, Rush, etc.


Heres a great article on crony capitalism.

"Crony capitalism is believed to arise when political cronyism spills over into the business world; self-serving friendships and family ties between businessmen and the government influence the economy and society to the extent that it corrupts public-serving economic and political ideals."

I think its pretty clear there is a lot of this going on. Bailouts anyone? Who received a lot of the stimulus money? Who donates the most to political campaigns? How many votes in congress are bought through lobbying? How many politicians make/change laws in favor of businesses that they invest in or their friends own?

I'm not questioning what crony capitalism is or whether or not it takes place. My point is that there's a difference between holding signs that attack intangible concepts....and actually working to bring about change.

You don't like shady quid pro quo business dealings? Expose the person in power who is making these corrupt deals and give them negative publicity. Then find a suitable replacement to support and rally your cause behind.

You don't like "corporate greed?" OK, do some research and find corporations with instances of greed that you deem unacceptable and raise awareness of these goings on. Then organize a boycott. If revenue and margins drop, the company will have to make changes. (side note - can anyone succinctly tell me what "corporate greed" really even is?)

I guess my main point is that I understand that we have problems, but unemployed 24 year old pseudo-intellectual weirdos stinking up public places and holding up signs with catchy but meaningless buzzword-filled phrases piss me off. Especially when they try to say they represent 99% of the population. Then dipshits like Quanell X, Sheila Jackson Lee, Nancy Pelosi, etc treat them like some noble revolutionaries that will go down as heroes one day.

I agree. Exposing it is much easier said than done though.

I think we are pretty far gone at this point. IMO, we need some fundamental changes in politics, economics, and society in general. The path we are on can only be sustained for so long.

For all of their 99% rhetoric, a lot of small business employees are being screwed over by the occupiers because they are dissuading so many people from passing through the area and into the stores, restaurants, etc. And in a few places, notably Oakland, they are DEMANDING these places of business all join them in shutting down all activity to join the momvement and causing a lot of trouble for any business who doesn't.

Most of the OWS "progressive" ideas won't fix this though. Ultimately no system can fix this, it's up to people to make the choice to right or to do wrong - and those people are mostly not the guys OWS wants in power (if they even know who or what they want).

It would be much easier to organize since they'd only have a few dozen people left nationwide and small groups are much simpler to coordinate. :D

So it's the occupy movement's "day of action", and apparently their "action" is to try and f**k up the day for people who actually work for a living. I can't believe this inane crap has gone on for this long. Their goal today was apparently to delay the opening of the NYSE, but as usual, they failed miserably. Wall St. is business as usual, and I think that's hilarious.

The pathetic signs they're holding up tell the story. Aside from the typical stupid "legalize marijuana" crap, they were showing a giant group of signs written in Spanish on CNN like "Somos el 99%", et al. I take enough issue with people who don't care to learn the language of our country to begin with, so for them to whine about how supposedly disadvantaged they are on top of that is just infuriating. Try learning f**king English and see if that doesn't help you get a job; that is, if you even want one. Oh, and I'm pretty sure you actually have to be a citizen before you can claim to be part of "the 99%".

Honestly, at this point, I wouldn't care if someone just napalmed whole groups of occupy protesters. Anyone who has been with this occupy movement this long is simply not a productive human. They're borderline terrorists at this point anyway, now choosing to just try and ruin things for others because their ineffectual movement can't seem to do anything else right. Honestly, I think it's only a matter of time before one of them goes off the deep end out of frustration and tries to blow up a bank or guns down some Wall St employees.

The Mayans may be on to something with the 2012 stuff. That this occupy stupidity persists does not speak well of our future as a society. You know, my reference to a napalm solution from earlier may be a little harsh. I vote instead that we deport all the occupy folks to Mexico and let them try to make their own society since they're so unhappy with America. It solves a bunch of issues. We get to take out the trash, and the occupy folks who think they have all the answers can try to run things as they see fit, with a plentiful supply of their beloved drugs on top of that. It would also be the greatest reality show ever. Occupy Mexico. At the very least, it will quickly remind the morons that they had it pretty damn good in America, even if they were too stupid to realize it.

Even scarier is their list of demands. Mother of God...

In defense, that is just a forum post

Saw this on another forum and had a nice laugh:

(Posted Image)

As idiotic as OWS is, what kind of heartless bastard asshole do you have to be to stand there as a cop and pull the trigger? Probably the same guys who were tired of getting picked on throughout school and dreamed of the day they could grow up and wield respect so they could be on the other side of things.