Title: What is Crabtree thinking?
True Grit - September 15, 2009 09:00 PM (GMT)
|The San Francisco 49ers have apparently reduced their offer to Crabtree, according to Yahoo! Sports' Michael Silver, and the team may keep reducing it each week that he doesn't play. The initial reduction is reportedly for $200,000.|
The 49ers are apparently willing to pay Crabtree up to one dollar less than what the No. 9 pick, Green Bay Packers defensive tackle B.J. Raji(notes), who supposedly got a five-year deal for $28.5 million with almost $18 million guaranteed. But Crabtree supposedly wants more than that and is willing to sit out the season for it.
Niners head coach Mike Singletary admitted that offering pay reduction to Crabtree had been discussed but wasn't sure if the deed had actually been done, according to the San Jose Mercury News: "At this time in the year, that may be the case. I'm not sure," Singletary told the paper. "I didn't want to hear about it any more after last Friday. I said, 'Hey, do what you have to do. I'm focused over here.'"
Enjoy the games on TV, Michael.
Is he really doing this for 200k? Seriously? He is making himself seem like a head case.
Raider - September 15, 2009 09:27 PM (GMT)
He's not thinking. He has the power to go over his handlers' heads and end this. Both sides are too entrenched into their arguments to make concessions, but SF has more reason to stand firm than MC. If he actually goes through with his sit-out, he's a complete idiot and deserves to lose the millions he'd inevitably lose.
He could be suiting up for Tech right now :banghead: :banghead: :thumbsdown:
True Grit - September 15, 2009 10:06 PM (GMT)
If he goes through with the sit out he is basically throwing his career away, imo. First of all, being away from football for a year will just be bad. Second, every team is seeing how big of a head case he is being and that will affect his draft stock for next year (as will being away from football for a year). If he does end up signing with SF he wont be the most popular guy in the locker room. Or with Singletary. Or with opposing players. If he does sign, his welcome into the NFL will not be a good one.
Raider - September 15, 2009 10:12 PM (GMT)
Those are all valid concerns, but I don't think it's as dire as you describe. Holdouts are very common and the vast majority of NFL players seem to have that "get money" mantra, so he wouldn't be despised in the locker room. He does seem to be very diva-ish, but if he can play, NFL teams will want him. Hell, TO is still in the league. Money-wise, sitting out is an idiotic move. Long-term, his career won't be that affected IF he performs well. That's the worst part. Had he signed on day 1, he'd get plenty of leeway and time to develop. After this drama, he's going to be expected to be a stud right away when he steps on the field.
True Grit - September 15, 2009 10:18 PM (GMT)
There is a difference between a veteran having the "get money" mantra and a rookie having it. And, yes, TO is obviously like that but he has also proven what he can do on the field. Crabtree hasnt taken a snap. This holdout is not only holding him back in terms of development, but in terms of gaining respect from the other players.
osu5nc - September 16, 2009 02:26 PM (GMT)
Just further evidence to never draft TTU players. With a head case at coach, it's passed right down to the players. It's not a shocker that Harrell didn't get drafted for this very reason.
Statalyzer - September 16, 2009 02:36 PM (GMT)
That's not why Harrell didn't get drafted.
Crabtree just doesn't seem to get it. Not many players get paid more than the guy who drafted right above them. Fall in line behind #9 and ahead of #11 and take your assload of dough.
Raider - September 16, 2009 02:58 PM (GMT)
|QUOTE (osu5nc @ Sep 16 2009, 08:26 AM)|
| Just further evidence to never draft TTU players. With a head case at coach, it's passed right down to the players. It's not a shocker that Harrell didn't get drafted for this very reason.|
I was preparing my verbal beatdown, but then I saw the ;) and realized it's all in jest. Well played.
TexasTech - September 17, 2009 07:16 PM (GMT)
Okay, I've kinda stayed out of this, but I'll share what I know. First of all, let me tell you a bit about Crabtree. I've spoken with him, interviewed him, and I've seen how he handles himself in practices, games, etc. for 2+ years, from both before Crabtree was the star he is now and even after his spectacular RS freshman season. Unless he's dramatically changed since then, here was my assessment of him. He is VERY confident in his abilities. He's also VERY shy and not at all the attention-whore "me" type that many of his detractors claim. He's not a terribly bright kid, but he's Einstein compared with the average kid out of Dallas Carter HS.
It is for these reasons that I believe he chose to defer his negotiations to an agent, and unfortunately, it appears he selected one who cares less about what is in Crabtree's best interest than what is best for him. This can be traced back to contacts Crabtree made training in the offseasons at Deion Sanders' "Prime U" camps. While this training gave him the opportunity to train against NFL corners and probably made him a better player, it also got a bunch of Deion's entourage full of guys with questionable character to all start promising Crabtree the moon by supposedly taking him under their wing, when really all that they want is to piggyback on Michael's potential so they can also cash in and live it up when he made it big. And Crabtree unfortunately appears to have trusted them.
Enter the NFL Combine. F-ing Heyward-Bey, a marginal talent even in college, manages to run a 4.3 40. And the Oakland Raiders, because they're retarded, think this means he will become a great player and take him 7th. This is where things go wrong. SF can't pass him up at #10. Crabtree and his camp decide that he is a better player than Heyward-Bey, which is unquestionably true, and thus try to at least get comparable compensation. I fully believe Crab said something to the effect of "get me what I'm worth" initially and has had little say in anything since. And I also believe that the entourage and Monroe are tripping all over themselves trying to be the one who makes the play that gets him signed, and that it's become a giant clusterf*ck since then.
That said, to date, SF has not made a particularly impressive offer. The only one that was even slot money featured incentive deals that were damn near unattainable given the general crappiness of SF and their current offensive scheme, especially considering their lack of a quality QB to get him the ball. The latest reduced offer is further evidence that they aren't overly interested in making anything happen, and that they are probably sick of dealing with Monroe and his boys. It's looking grim for Crabtree's future in SF.
Still, I think that there is more to this than anyone knows. I'd be willing to bet that there is some team(s) (probably who picked past 10th) who promised Crabtree that if SF doesn't come through with a fair deal, they will pick him up. There simply HAS to be a contingency plan giving them bargaining power, otherwise Monroe is the worst agent in the history of sports and Crabtree is every bit as dumb as his harshest critics say. Let's hypothetically say that the Patriots, who are notorious for making brilliant non-draft day acquisitions, are Crabtree's ace-in-the-hole. Suddenly Crabtree seems like a genius if he ends up playing for a winning franchise and getting big-time money. (A Crabtree/Moss/Welker WR corps with Brady tossing them the ball would be f-ing unstoppable, BTW) It's probably unrealistic for the Pats given salary cap issues, but there are teams like Indianapolis, San Diego, etc. running pass-heavy schemes that would probably at least be tempted.
And for those thinking that he has screwed himself and that no one will want him after this, look around the league. The premium is on talent in the NFL, especially at the receiver spot. Even guys who actually are as divaish as Crabtree is purported to be like T.O. have had little trouble finding roster spots. And even if damn near every team does shy away from him, it opens the door for Jerry Jones, who has never had a problem taking a chance on a guy with talent. Especially a local star people would REALLY pay to see.
Crabtree is the closest thing to the NFL's best current WR, Larry Fitzgerald, that the modern college game has produced. In fact, his collegiate accolades are arguably more impressive. There is no question he has value and tremendous upside. I can't say I blame the kid for wanting what he deserves, even if he has surrounded himself with morons and potentially thrown away at least part of a fortune few ever have a chance at. However, he has a right to be insulted that SF isn't ponying up the dough that represents faith in him being at least as good as Heyward-Bey, and further to be insulted by the latest reduced offer. And SF has a right to be insulted that Crabtree wants more than slot money. It's a crappy situation, because both sides have a point, and neither appear to be budging.
One thing's for sure, if Crabtree ends working something out with SF, he must be every bit as good as he's supposed to be, otherwise it'll get ugly fast. And while the league has proven time and again that a poor reputation of character can be forgiven, few are willing to take chances on guys that don't produce. At this point, though, I'm thinking that Crabtree ends up elsewhere with a better franchise and probably slightly less initial money, but if this is the case, he probably has a far better chance to come out ahead in the end. I sincerely hope that everything works out for the best for him, both as a Tech fan and a football fan in general, because it will be an absolute shame if the game is robbed of his talents on display for the next decade. Time will tell this tale...
osu5nc - September 17, 2009 08:15 PM (GMT)
Teams don't pay out of their slots. I get that he has an ego, but I don't know why he thinks that SF is going to reach out of their slot to sign him.
And BTW, calling Heyward-Bey a marginal college talent? Come on man, the kid was a great college player.
True Grit - September 17, 2009 08:20 PM (GMT)
Even if Heyward isnt as good as Crabtree, Crabtree cant expect to get payed more. Thats not how it works. The higher drafted player gets payed more, even if he isnt as good.
Raider - September 17, 2009 09:51 PM (GMT)
|QUOTE (TexasTech @ Sep 17 2009, 01:16 PM)|
| Still, I think that there is more to this than anyone knows. |
Bingo. It's obviously more involved than the average sports fan will know about.
|That said, to date, SF has not made a particularly impressive offer. The only one that was even slot money featured incentive deals that were damn near unattainable given the general crappiness of SF and their current offensive scheme, especially considering their lack of a quality QB to get him the ball.|
I've heard that, too. Allegedly, San Fran tried to tie too much of his pay to arbitrary, lofty performance goals. Not saying Crabtree is 100% justified in his holdout, but it's pretty wrong to pass judgment on the guy and some of the comments about him are pretty extreme. I'm frustrated by the situation and think he and SF are both being annoyingly stubborn, but Crabtree's a good guy that is YOUNG and caught up in a messy situation. He won't hold out forever; he'll get on the field soon enough and all this crap will be forgotten. I just wish he woulda waited one more year to go pro. Three-time Biletnikoff winner woulda been nice :(
TexasTech - September 18, 2009 01:34 AM (GMT)
Holy crap, he just asked Lou Holtz for advice. This is even worse than I thought.
Statalyzer - September 18, 2009 01:44 AM (GMT)
|QUOTE (osu5nc @ Sep 17 2009, 03:15 PM)|
| And BTW, calling Heyward-Bey a marginal college talent? Come on man, the kid was a great college player. |
42 catches, 609 yds, 5 TDs
51 catches, 786 yds, 3 TDs
45 catches, 694 yds, 5 TDs
Nothing that really jumps out at you...
VTHokie - September 18, 2009 02:30 AM (GMT)
Yeah, Heyward-Bey was nothing special. He was a pretty good WR that had a LOT of speed. However, in terms of production, he was not a scary player at all. He ran average routes and didn't really have a knack of getting open.
Statalyzer - October 7, 2009 03:10 PM (GMT)
|After months of holding out, wide receiver Michael Crabtree has agreed to a contract with the San Francisco 49ers.|
The deal, first reported by ESPN NFL Insider Adam Schefter, was confirmed by 49ers spokesman Bob Lange in a text message to The Associated Press early Wednesday.
Crabtree will get a six-year deal that he can void to five years if he meets undefined performance clauses, a league source told ESPN's Michael Smith.
No word on the deal but I imagine he's taking what they were offering him a couple of months ago anyway. However, "agreed" doesn't mean "signed", so it's not a 100% sure thing yet.
Raider - October 7, 2009 03:16 PM (GMT)
Glad they came to an "agreement." Now I hope he can get on the field soon and work toward earning some respect. He's going to get some serious boos when he first steps on the field. After a few TDs they'll start to forgive him, but it's gonna be a rough road for a while.
TexasTech - October 7, 2009 04:18 PM (GMT)
|QUOTE (Raider @ Oct 7 2009, 10:16 AM)|
| Glad they came to an "agreement." Now I hope he can get on the field soon and work toward earning some respect. He's going to get some serious boos when he first steps on the field. After a few TDs they'll start to forgive him, but it's gonna be a rough road for a while. |
Yeah, he better be f-ing perfect when he takes the field, because even the littlest mistakes will have some people hollering. But judging by the 49ers forums, most of them seem thrilled the deal got done, so I don't think he's going to get heavily booed upon taking the field or anything. If he drops a pass early or something, then I'd expect that kind of stuff to follow. Still, Crabtree's talent is pretty much undeniable, and I think even his most vocal critics are excited about his potential. His first game with significant reps is going to be critical, and all eyes will be on him. Hopefully he doesn't disappoint.
Statalyzer - October 7, 2009 08:00 PM (GMT)
I just heard he got trade to the Jets for basically nothing (3rd round draft pick and one player I've never heard of). That sounds like a big steal for the Jets, especially if this picking up of Edwards works out for them, but I haven't found a link yet so I'm taking it with a grain of salt.
True Grit - October 7, 2009 08:25 PM (GMT)
It will be interesting to see how he does. I dont think he will do much at all this season. Rookie WRs generally dont contribute much, and missing training camp will hurt him pretty bad.
TexasTech - October 7, 2009 08:47 PM (GMT)
|QUOTE (True Grit @ Oct 7 2009, 03:25 PM)|
| It will be interesting to see how he does. I dont think he will do much at all this season. Rookie WRs generally dont contribute much, and missing training camp will hurt him pretty bad. |
You might be surprised. "Missing" his true FR season made him that much more competitive from not being on the field, and he came out of the gate with insane drive to post the best receiving season in collegiate history. I don't expect him to immediately dominate in the NFL, but I'd be shocked if he didn't show some flashes of his talent quickly. He's among the top 10-20 WRs in terms of raw ability right now, IMO, even though he's yet to prove it. I don't think it will be that much of an adjustment for him, because the one good thing out of this Deion Sanders relationship is that he's already been practicing against NFL corners. Not to mention he's been working out with Dilfer and had the tutelage of several other NFLers. The only area of concern, IMO, is getting on the same page with Hill and the other WRs. If he can take care of that quickly, he'll prove what he's capable of and be a difference maker by the end of the season.
True Grit - October 7, 2009 09:37 PM (GMT)
Missing your true freshman season in college is much, much different than missing training camp and the first 4 games your rookie season. There is no doubt he is extremely talented, but you cannot understate how much missing training camp hurts him. I dont think he will do much this season. Should be great in the future, as long as he isnt a prima donna.
VTHokie - October 7, 2009 09:50 PM (GMT)
Yeah, but why did he miss his true freshman year? If he was redshirting, he was still practicing. The man hasn't done anything football related in a team environment since January 1. Not only that, but he has not one inkling of his new team's playbook... or of ANY NFL playbook.
Crabtree will do next to nothing this year IMO.
Raider - October 7, 2009 10:12 PM (GMT)
He missed his freshman year because the NCAA is stupid. He was on scout team that year. He has been working out quite a bit and physically I'm sure he's ready to go. But nothing will replace the game experience, so he's certainly behind. This season, I just hope he gets in on some easy, set plays where he just has to know what route to run. Let him get his feet wet and take a few hits. Who knows, maybe he'll fit right in and make some plays (if they locate a QB out there).
Statalyzer - October 7, 2009 10:25 PM (GMT)
|because the one good thing out of this Deion Sanders relationship is that he's already been practicing against NFL corners|
Should also give Crabtree lots of confidence in being able to make YAC in the NFL. :D
TexasTech - October 8, 2009 01:45 PM (GMT)
|QUOTE (Statalyzer @ Oct 7 2009, 05:25 PM)|
Should also give Crabtree lots of confidence in being able to make YAC in the NFL. :D
Well, to clarify, he wasn't practicing against Deion himself in the camp; it was some current NFL players. Probably a good thing, too, because we don't want Crabtree expecting the DBs to try the "fall down and hope he trips over me" pathetic excuse for a tackle that Deion was famous for.
Raider - October 21, 2009 02:14 PM (GMT)
Looks like Crab is going to see his first game action this weekend against the Texans. Rumor is he might even start. Singletary is pleased with his progress and ready to unleash him. He has a long way to go if he wants to measure up to the top WR taken in the 09 draft. Wait...no, he can probably equal that production in one game. Should be fun to see how he does.
Statalyzer - October 21, 2009 10:07 PM (GMT)
|He has a long way to go if he wants to measure up to the top WR taken in the 09 draft. Wait...no, he can probably equal that production in one game.|
TexasTech - October 22, 2009 06:12 PM (GMT)
|'Diva' talk misplaced with Crabtree so far|
October 21, 2009 9:09 PM
Posted by ESPN.com's Mike Sando
I think it's a good sign for the 49ers than no-nonsense coach Mike Singletary is vouching for recently signed rookie receiver Michael Crabtree.
While the 49ers badly need playmakers on offense, Singletary doesn't strike me as a smoke blower on things that matter to him. Here's what he said when reporters asked why Crabtree would be in consideration for a starting job in his first game since reporting:
"I think itís a matter of sense of urgency for him. Heís had a tremendous attitude coming in with some of the guys really ribbing him, a tough love kind of deal. Coaches as well. He has responded with nothing less than a smile and, 'OK, coach. I got it, but can I see the playbook? Coach, how about this question? How about this route? How about this?'
"When you have a kid like that and he comes out, the young man works hard every day. He doesnít really have to tell you what heís been doing while he wasnít here. You see it. You see it in his route running. You see it in the way he runs the route and his margin for, I guess, running a bad route or whatever. Thatís not something you see very often. You tell him something one time, it's normally the only time you have to tell him. I think there are a lot of reasons. It shows why we drafted him where we drafted him at the 10th slot. So, Iím excited to see what he has. So, going forward, I just think that it's going to be in our best interest offensively to try and find out how much of an effect that he can have to our offense, how much of a playmaker he really can be."
So far, so good, in other words. The 'diva' talk will subside for now.
TexasTech - October 26, 2009 02:38 AM (GMT)
Good debut for Crabtree. Made some tough catches, catching 5 of the 6 thrown his way, with the only "drop" being on an overthrown sideline route. And the Heyward-Bey/Crabtree comparison chart is hilarious.
Michael Crabtree vs. Darius Heyward-Bey
Targets 6 22
Rec. 5 2
Catch pct. 83.3 9.1
Yards 56 36
FWIW, Welker had another big day as well, notching 107 yds and a TD. Good to see at least a few Red Raiders show up this weekend.
vthokiefan05 - October 26, 2009 05:37 AM (GMT)
Welker has been a very good fantasy option to use. I have had in my leagues the last couple seasons and he continues to put up spectacular numbers, usually consistently.
Raider - October 26, 2009 06:21 PM (GMT)
Well, Oakland has a terrible QB throwing to Heyward-Bey. Oh wait, SF has QB problems, too. Nice game from Crab, hope he improves on it. I like how he said he was pleased with his performance, but still has work to do.
TexasTech - October 26, 2009 07:13 PM (GMT)
I have a sneaking suspicion that the Niners OC is a full-on retard. First off, he raised some eyebrows when he said he hadn't watched any college film on Crabtree, but estimates that he basically only ran two routes while at Tech. Yeah....okay. Then, they wasted the entire first half of the Texans game running this vanilla crap, repeatedly sending Gore up the middle with these 2 TE bunch sets where everyone knows they're going to run it. They really don't do sh*t on offense, and the Texans build a huge lead. The second half, they give Alex Smith a chance and go a little more spread out, putting 3-4 WRs on the field at the same time. Instantly, the offense improves by leaps and bounds, scoring 21 points on three of the final 5 possessions. Now, I know the NFL considers the spread taboo, but come on. You have a formerly great spread QB and the greatest spread receiver of all-time. Your offense sucks otherwise anyway. Maybe it's spread time. Unless you guys just think it was a coincidence that Smith, who has previously been complete garbage, just suddenly had an epiphany.
Also, I'm not sure what Isaac Bruce brings to the table at this point, if anything, yet they decided to try and go to him repeatedly on the final drive, which of course didn't work. There was a time about 8 years ago when he could outplay DBs like that to win games, but not anymore. Crabtree pretty much ensures that Bruce is about to be pushed out the door for both talent and cap reasons, so it's probably time to start working in Morgan and some of the other guys. Just a thought.
Raider - October 26, 2009 07:36 PM (GMT)
Amendola also had a nice day. He's quietly securing himself a regular paycheck. Although...it can't be THAT hard to make the Rams roster...
Statalyzer - October 26, 2009 10:13 PM (GMT)
|Now, I know the NFL considers the spread taboo|
I'm not sure why they do this though. The Rams won a Super Bowl and set offensive records with it in 1999, and the Patriots went undefeated in the regular season and made the Super Bowl with it in 2007. It's not like it's some unproven bizarre scheme.
Raider - October 26, 2009 11:01 PM (GMT)
Because Mike Ditka and John Madden say that real football is running the ball and playing "hard nosed, smash-mouth football" where the final score should be 7-3.
Raider - December 15, 2009 02:33 PM (GMT)
|QUOTE (VTHokie @ Oct 7 2009, 03:50 PM)|
| Crabtree will do next to nothing this year IMO. |
Crab's lookin good, that TD last night was awesome. REALLY wish he would've played since week 1 :banghead:
TexasTech - December 15, 2009 03:01 PM (GMT)
Yeah, that was a nice TD for sure. It was one of those catches where he extends like he's diving for the catch, yet somehow maintains his feet. His body control is amazing. Gruden was giving him some mad props by the end of the night. Oh, and during halftime, Welker won Boomer's game ball of the week for another 10 catch, 105 yard day. I didn't get to see it, but apparently Welker got lit up on a play where everyone thought he was going to be injured. Except he got up, trotted back to the huddle, caught a first down the next play, got the crowd fired up, and tallied 65 yards on a huge scoring drive. Sportswriters are crediting Wes for changing the course of the game and calling him the best player on the team. Sounds like Wes is transcending the "he's a good slot receiver" talk and finally getting credit for the great player that he is. Good stuff.
Statalyzer - January 4, 2010 04:15 PM (GMT)
Final tally that proves the Raiders are a bunch of morons:
Crabtree: 48 catches (70th), 625 yards (58th), 13.0 yards/catch, 56.8 yards/game (37th), 2 TDs
Heywood-Bey: 9 catches (254th), 124 yards (228th), 13.8 yards/catch, 11.3 yards/game (219th), 1 TD.
Raider - January 4, 2010 04:58 PM (GMT)
Oh, and he missed six games.