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 A question on Primarch Honour Guard., Some Primarchs appear to go solo.
Poizen_Brush
Posted: Mar 20 2011, 12:21 PM


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Hello to everyone on Great Crusade!

I've been working on my Primarch Honour Guard for my Pre-Heresy Nightlords (I'll make sure to post a WIP page in the Nightlords section!). I am aware that the fluff (or at least what I've read) hasn't revealed if The Night Haunter is accompanied by such a squad, but then two questions stirred into being...

"Which of the Primarchs do not have Honour Guard and if not why?"

From what I understand of the unit they are the closest representation of the nature of their Primarch's doctrines and combat styles, for example Fulgrim's Pheonix Guard acquired the greatest skill level of martial perfection above their fellow Astartes brothers.
But on the other side of the argument Horus was never described to have an Honour Guard in tow, in fact the closest thing he had to such a retinue, eventhough it amassed off the battlefield, in my opinion was the Mournival.

So what do you all think?
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The Red Sorcerer
Posted: Mar 21 2011, 04:36 PM


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To be honest, I think the Primarch most likely to have no honour guard is, in fact, Kurze himself. Going by his background, he's the most likely to have preferred operating alone. The other likely candidate would be Alpharius, who clearly preferred to conceal himself among the rank and file.

As for the Primarchs in general, most seem to have (usually) taken to the field with a Honour Guard/bodyguard unit of some sort. However, it seems some were more formalised formations than others - many Primarchs merely were accompanied by their First Company (their most experienced veterans) rather than having a more formal 'named' bodyguard unit. The ones we know about so far:

Dark Angels - The Lion Guard (Horus Heresy CCG)
Emperor's Children - The Phoenix Guard (Fulgrim)
Space Wolves - Wolf Guard - Russ, like the Wolf Lords that commanded each Company, had his own personal retinue of Wolf Guard; Bjorn the Fell Handed is mentioned as being the only member left behind by the Primarch (Codex - Space Wolves)
Imperial Fists - The Huscarls (The Lightning Tower)
Blood Angels - The Sanguinary Guard (Codex - Blood Angels)
World Eaters - The Devourers (Horus Heresy CCG)
Death Guard - The Deathshroud (Flight of the Eisenstein)
Thousand Sons - The Rehahti (Horus Heresy CCG)
Salamanders - The Pyre Guard (Promethean Sun)
Alpha Legion - Effrit Stealth Squad (Legion) - although this is Omegon's squad rather than Alpharius', and it is not clear weather Omegon's position as head of the squad is a permenant position or merely adopted as and when he wishes.

As for the rest:
Night Lords - None mentioned. Most likely accompanying unit would be the Unguis Raptus, the comand company of the Raptors, led by Captain Zso Sahaal (Lord of the Night)
Iron Hands - Ferrus fights with the Morlocks, the Legion's terminator elite. There are several companies of Morlocks at least, so they are not a bodyguard unit per se.
Ultramarines - The First Heretic mentions a Honour Guard unit, but they are not named.
Sons of Horus - As you say, the best matches are the Mournival (a council of senior Captains) or the Justaerin (the Legions Terminator elite lead by Abaddon the First Captain).
Word Bearers - Lorgar fights with the First Company, but no actual 'bodyguard' unit is mentioned
Raven Guard, Iron Warriros, White Scars - Nothing mentioned.

This post has been edited by The Red Sorcerer on Jul 26 2011, 10:35 AM
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Poizen_Brush
Posted: Mar 21 2011, 05:43 PM


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Thanks for making the subject alot more clearer to me, if that is the case with Konrad I feel gutted that I've spent time and effort into making that Honour Guard for my collection. unsure.gif *sigh*

Nevermind, could alway use them for vanguard veterans I guess.

Anyway cheers for your in-depth reply and take care! smile.gif
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The Red Sorcerer
Posted: Mar 21 2011, 06:15 PM


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Feel free to use them as a bodyguard unit - even if Kurze didn't have a 'formal' bodyguard in the same way as some of the other Primarchs (and there's no official background saying he didn't, after all) he would certainly have at least occasionally been accompanied by a group of the Legions best veterans. Use them as the finest veterans from the Unguis Raptus (jump pack equipped veterans, who embody much of Kurze's tactical thinking) led by Zso Sahaal 'The Talonmaster' - if/when Kurze wanted a unit to accompany him, these guys would be by far the most likely candidate.
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Apologist
Posted: Mar 24 2011, 03:05 PM


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A John Blanche sketch in Visions of Heresy has an Ultramarine Honour Guard called the 'Varangian', presumably in reference to Basil II's (Byzantine Emperor) bodyguard.
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Archmagos_Amadeus
Posted: Mar 24 2011, 04:48 PM


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Actually, in Raven's Flight, Agapito mentions to Corax that he disbanded his Honor Guard. Corax's reply indicates that the bodyguard was largely ceremonial in nature, and their purpose was more to assuage his brothers and his father.

Since they could so easily be spread out across the legion, the guard was more than likely a squad of Vanguard Veterans
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Malcharion the War Sage
Posted: Mar 24 2011, 06:28 PM


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Useful information can be found in Aaron Dembski-Bowden's "Soul Huunter", which is almost a closet Horus Heresy novel and in the last third of "the First Heretic".
But basically, the closest thing to our beloved Night Haunter would be the Atramentar, even though they are only succinctly depicted.
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renlegunvrs
Posted: Mar 28 2011, 04:14 PM


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even then the atramentaur were the honourt guard of the exaulted and not Curze. the exaulted was the tenth companies leader at the time of curzes death post 30k right before the long war started.
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Vinnie
Posted: Mar 28 2011, 04:38 PM


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The Atramentar are present in the scene set in the Screaming Gallery, and I think ADB makes it quite clear that they're Curze's highest cadre of warriors, but I got the impression that they operate kind of autonomously to each other, serving with whichever captain they prefer. Evidenced by the fact that they all spurn Sahaal just because he's Terran.

So yeah, he had one, but didn't really fight with them.
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Pacific
Posted: Mar 29 2011, 01:38 AM


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I think you have to think of circumstances Vinnie. Imagine some kind of ship boarding action or a force being teleported down into a command bunker, the Primarch wouldn't be alone he would most likely have a group of 'chosen' veterans with him.

And I think even on an open field of battle he would have some kind of jump-pack equipped veteran unit tailing him, exploiting the big holes he leaves in the opposing forces as he bounces around like a pinball biggrin.gif
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The Red Sorcerer
Posted: Jul 26 2011, 10:33 AM


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Another named Honour Guard unit, courtesy of Promethean Sun - Vulcan is accompanied by the Pyre Guard, Terran veterans (drawn from the Firedrakes) in ornate power armour.

This post has been edited by The Red Sorcerer on Jul 26 2011, 10:36 AM
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ShroudFilm
Posted: Jul 26 2011, 11:52 AM


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No relation to the Spire Guard, as confusing as the phrase "Vulkan's Pyre Guard" was to hear spoken in meetings at BL... rolleyes.gif
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Leman Russ SW
Posted: Jul 26 2011, 12:09 PM


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Wolf Guard are the Veterans of each Great Company. Russ has a body guard called The Varangi. Bjorn is the last of these.
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The Red Sorcerer
Posted: Jul 26 2011, 12:39 PM


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As far as I know, the Varangi only crop up as a picture in Collected Visions, and they are noted as being 'Russ' Veterans'. Seeing as the bacground on Bjorn states he was part of Russ' 'personal Wolf Guard', there's a bit of a contradiction at present. Seeing as - unlike other Primarch bodyguard units shown in Collected Visions - Russ isn't included in the image of the Varangi (contrast with Magnus' Rehati and Angron's Devourers for example) and there's actually a separate image listed as 'Leman Russ and Bodyguard', I'm not convinced the Varangi were actually a bodyguard unit as opposed to a senior formation of veterans or something similar.

This post has been edited by The Red Sorcerer on Jul 26 2011, 12:41 PM
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