White Jet Analysis

JohnDoeX, Merc --=-

Whereas the photo you posted is clearly a jet, there was a C-130 circling the pentagon at the same time as the pentagon was struck.

i've always marveled at how jet fighter couldn't be scrambled in time to intercept the 4 flights, but good old "fat albert" C130 puttering along at max airspeed 345mph manages to do it -- and then, in a hat trick, fly over shanksville crash site, too.

What does a 707 E3A look like from below?

This post has been edited by jdyolam on Jul 27 2006, 12:05 AM

The two pictures look like different planes in my opinion.

The video with british television looks like a b-52 and the pic that is grainy looks exactly like a 747-400 like Johndoex said. So I personally see two different planes in question here. Also the 747 type plane looks as though it's climbing in altitude due to the tail section being visible to the extent it is in that photo.

I'm going to try and locate more video of the b-52 looking plane in it's raw footage or longer cleaner version. The wing span of the b-52 looking plane looks longer in my eyes. Nothing much more for me to add as you guys have done the work, but I feel this is an important topic as well, so I'll try to help you guys out as much as I can.

witness accounts of addditional planes. some see c-130 some see jet. perhaps all 3.




9:37 a.m.: Witnesses See Military Cargo Plane Near Flight 77; Pilot Implies He’s Far Away

A C-130 transport plane that has been sent to follow Flight 77 is trailing only a short distance behind the plane as it crashes. This curious C-130, originally bound for Minnesota, is the same C-130 that will be 17 miles from Flight 93 when it later crashes into the Pennsylvania countryside. [Star-Tribune (Minneapolis), 9/11/2002; Pittsburgh Channel, 9/15/2001] A number of people see this plane fly remarkably close to Flight 77:
bullet Kelly Knowles says that seconds after seeing Flight 77 pass, she sees a “second plane that seemed to be chasing the first [pass] over at a slightly different angle.” [Daily Press (Newport News), 9/15/2001]
bullet Keith Wheelhouse says the second plane was a C-130; two other witnesses aren’t certain. [Daily Press (Newport News), 9/15/2001] Wheelhouse “believes it flew directly above the American Airlines jet, as if to prevent two planes from appearing on radar, while at the same time guiding the jet toward the Pentagon.” As Flight 77 descends toward the Pentagon, the second plane veers off west. [Daily Press (Newport News), 9/14/2001]
bullet USA Today reporter Vin Narayanan, who saw the Pentagon explosion, says, “I hopped out of my car after the jet exploded, nearly oblivious to a second jet hovering in the skies.” [USA Today, 9/17/2001]
bullet USA Today Editor Joel Sucherman sees a second plane but gives few details. [eWeek, 9/13/2001] Brian Kennedy, press secretary for a congressman, and others also see a second plane. [Sacramento Bee, 9/15/2001]
bullet An unnamed worker at Arlington National Cemetery “said a mysterious second plane was circling the area when the first one attacked the Pentagon.” [Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, 12/20/2001]
bullet John O’Keefe is driving a car when he sees the Pentagon crash. “The first thing I did was pull over onto the shoulder, and when I got out of the car I saw another plane flying over my head. ... Then the plane—it looked like a C-130 cargo plane—started turning away from the Pentagon, it did a complete turnaround.” [New York Law Journal, 9/12/2001]
bullet The pilot of the C-130, Lieutenant Colonel Steve O’Brien, is later interviewed, but his account differs from the on-the-ground eyewitnesses. He claims that just before the explosion, “With all of the East Coast haze, I had a hard time picking him out,” implying he is not nearby. He also says that just after the explosion, “I could see the outline of the Pentagon,” again implying he is not nearby. He then asks “the controller whether [I] should set up a low orbit around the building,” but he is told “to get out of the area as quickly as possible.” “I took the plane once through the plume of smoke and thought if this was a terrorist attack, it probably wasn’t a good idea to be flying through that plume.” [Star-Tribune (Minneapolis), 9/11/2002]

Also, i dont think its a plane that would have done the flyover. No one would miss a B-52 or 747 at low height or the 4 engines.

Its quite possible whatever airplane it was (747 or B-52), it was an electronic platform guiding a remote drone into the pentagon.. .whether the drone was a 757, 737, or global hawk.

Or... it could just be a 747 on its way into Dulles. But im also thinking those are two different airplanes. The B-52 is commonly mistaken for a 747. Both are Boeing aircraft. But the B-52 doesnt have such fat wings like the 747.

No when I said flyover in this case, I don't mean, the low altitude pull up and flyover. I simply meant, a plane dives OVER the Pentagon, pulls out of the dive and flies back over Washington. (Yes, that white plane was seen over Washington AFTER the Pentagon was hit). BOOM! Explosion. Then everyone around assumes that was the plane that did it.

Just tossin' ideas around.

I like your idea about the white plane launching a drone and/or guiding one.

Kinda like this:

http://s15.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_F...?showtopic=4594

The only way to tell what it was or where it was going. Is to learn the approximate time of that video and the location. I don't think it is going to Dulles. If it is over ANC, as claimed. In that dive, and on that flight path is NOT going to Dulles.

I personally, am going to stick with those being the same plane. Unless we get a cleaner BBC video.

To me it makes sense that they ran out of resources. Brazenly figured they could fly a four engine navy plane over Washington and then dive over ANC and people would think they saw "the plane that hit the Pentagon". I am still not convinced all the "low altitude flying over Columbia Pike/395 etc" witness accounts are genuine.

Also, i dont think its a plane that would have done the flyover. No one would miss a B-52 or 747 at low height or the 4 engines.

Its quite possible whatever airplane it was (747 or B-52), it was an electronic platform guiding a remote drone into the pentagon.. .whether the drone was a 757, 737, or global hawk.

Or... it could just be a 747 on its way into Dulles. But im also thinking those are two different airplanes. The B-52 is commonly mistaken for a 747. Both are Boeing aircraft. But the B-52 doesnt have such fat wings like the 747.

No when I said flyover in this case, I don't mean, the low altitude pull up and flyover. I simply meant, a plane dives OVER the Pentagon, pulls out of the dive and flies back over Washington. (Yes, that white plane was seen over Washington AFTER the Pentagon was hit). BOOM! Explosion. Then everyone around assumes that was the plane that did it.

Just tossin' ideas around.

I like your idea about the white plane launching a drone and/or guiding one.

Kinda like this:

http://s15.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_F...?showtopic=4594

The only way to tell what it was or where it was going. Is to learn the approximate time of that video and the location. I don't think it is going to Dulles. If it is over ANC, as claimed. In that dive, and on that flight path is NOT going to Dulles.

I personally, am going to stick with those being the same plane. Unless we get a cleaner BBC video.

To me it makes sense that they ran out of resources. Brazenly figured they could fly a four engine navy plane over Washington and then dive over ANC and people would think they saw "the plane that hit the Pentagon". I am still not convinced all the "low altitude flying over Columbia Pike/395 etc" witness accounts are genuine.

something to remember, the ground stop didnt really occur until 9:42 whichi is when the first order was given to the planes themselves to land, this is just after the pentagon hit. so maybe we could find logs of what flights were taking off from dulles around that time? johndoe you seem to be the most informed as to how we could do this.

Water bender,

Where is the link you were referring to about that BBC video being shot from ANC, with the Anchor mentioning it, etc?

http://perso.orange.fr/jpdesm/pentagon/pag...fct-videos.html


about halfway down

http://perso.orange.fr/jpdesm/pentagon/pag...fct-videos.html


about halfway down

Oh it was on Jean Pierre's site?

I can't believe I missed that. Good lookin'.

Now that I look at the the pictures of the two in question, I can see it possibly being the same plane. Angles play such a huge part in the way something looks, just small tilts or angles can make items look completely different. There for, this could still be the same plane. Shehhsh haha I'll let you guys work on this.

This is a working link of the footage of that plane:

http://www.earth-citizens.net/misc/barak-bbc.mpg

I also can't see how much engines this plane has.

This post has been edited by Wilbert on Jul 28 2006, 11:34 PM

thanks for the link, but we have already put that one up, if you can find a link of better quality that would be more helpful.

Here's a small collage i made of some jets. The white jet in the middle is the white jet seen near the Pentagon on 9/11. I added an E-6 (B707) and a B747 to see what type of jet this white jet is. Seems that the white jet is a 747 and not an E-6 (707), concur?

Three things to look at, the tail wings on the white jet and 747 are fatter than the tail wings of the E-6 (707). Wings are swept further back on the 747 and white jet than the E-6. Engine placement is different for the E-6 than the white jet and 747.

If you want to make one more test, see if you can find a represenatative picture of the Airbus A340 (I believe that its' number)

That is the only other 4-engine widebody currently in use, mostly in Europe and Asia, but some do fly international routes to the USA.

I merged this thread with the one i started on the same subject a few weeks ago.. (last week?). Please review page one.

you guys still need clear video of the white plane? cause i have two. the source clip from LC2E, and a random shot from a Discovery Channel Flight 93 documentary...which is interesting to say the least.

Yes Dylan, please post them for me and i'll compare those. I would like some clearer photos of that white jet from the pentagon that was on the news that day.

click the picture for video...

go nuts, kids. i can't figure it out.

Thank you Dylan! The video isn't working. All i hear is sound, but this white jet is DEFINITELY a 747, just as i assumed earlier. The best way to notice a 747 is the "hump" on the front of the plane:

Seems that the logo on the tail and the stripe are all black and white or dark blue. AKA, USAF?

This post has been edited by BoneZ on Aug 7 2006, 11:22 PM

yea sorry the video is DivX I believe...now the question is, who shot this, and when?

I have the mystery jet!!!!!! This is so cool, i can't believe i found it! It's an E-4B!!!









More pictures and info on the E-4B can be found here and elsewhere on google:

http://www.fas.org/nuke/guide/usa/c3i/e-4b.htm

Now begs the question, WTF is an E-4B doing flying around during the attacks AT THE ATTACK SITES!!!???

but what about that white tailfin on the vertical stabilizer? or am i seeing things...

good spot!

You're just seeing the tip of the port side wing.

so whaddya think this plane was doing? controlling or watching?

If i stop posting here, it's because i "disappeared" due to finding this out. This really is a smoking gun. This is a command and communications jet. Anyone can speculate however they like as to what this jet is doing in PA and over the Pentagon and possibly at the WTC.

I find it hard to believe they could get a command/communications jet to at least 2 attack sites, but couldn't get our fighters there in time. So if i had to speculate, i would say commanding and controlling, probably not just "watching".

Can someone please post the video of the white jet at the WTC? I would like to see if it matches this one.