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Title: Special HQ units


Xaigion - August 11, 2011 05:02 PM (GMT)
So I've been thinking about switching out one of my Sorc HQ units for one of the named guys(as a trial). I was really liking Fabius or Lucius( i get a chuckle from picking the Emperors Children entries) as they both have some rather useful army manipulation rules. Heres how I'm seeing it:


Fabius:
Pros:
FNP and extra attacks are good.
Rod with Instant Death on anything it hits is pretty sweet.
The enhanced warriors could be nice and add a little spice to the game. Certainly feels fluffy that AL would attempt to give our units a bonus(perhaps new Power Armor that goes haywire with a 1 or 6 on the chart).
Points are pretty cheap, so no loss of units to field him.

Cons: The needler is kinda neat but seems like it would be useless against half the armies.
Leaves him as CC, which is good but doesnt move as fast as my Sorc with wings....will have to give him the keys to my Land Raider......


Lucius:
Pros:
Sweet googly moogly could he be a beast in CC.
Auto S4 that ignore armor hits when he armor saves? Yes please.
All CC attacks reduced by 1 to a min of 1? Dont bother charging him boys.
Doom siren, LoT and power sword makes him just deadly in CC and getting to it.
Points are low as well.

Cons:
Other than having to get him to CC, I think hes a solid CC HQ choice.



Perhaps I'm off base on my estimate of the in-game usability of the guys but they seem like they could be pretty solid choices. Any suggestions on using them or if other Special HQ choices have worked for you?

WarpWhisperer - August 11, 2011 10:25 PM (GMT)
TBH, I don't really use the special characters much, so I can't be much help on this, other to say that Abaddon is reasonable, but his points may be a little excessive, and you'll hate those rolls of 1 with his daemon weapon! :facepalm:

The problem I see with Lucius is that he's going to need to strike first, which certainly against BA and DE heroes could be a problem, and that his attacks/invulernable save might be a little low for his points. Still, I know I've looked at the rules before, and almost bought a model for him....

Bile on the other hand; well he seems just a waste of time if you ask me.

The rod of torment is not a power weapon, so your opponent has to fail their standard save; most multi-wound models also have reasonable saves. FNP is no substitute for an invulnerable save, and as it doesn't confer this to a squad seems a waste of time The needler might be useful against monstrous creatures, but the AP of 6 lets it down, and the enhanced warrior table seems random and expensive for little gain. I would say that he's just a gimmicky character who doesn't shine at all.

Although having just read Flight of the Eisenstein, I find it quite amusing that if it weren't for him, the Inqusition might not have been founded ;)

Xaigion - August 11, 2011 10:51 PM (GMT)
I agree on Bile, although I think you dont give the rod enough credit. As far as Lucius goes I was really thinking he was the most viable. I dont think he needs to hit first and the saves are decent. Hes only 160 points, which is on par for my current HQ units. I focus quite a bit on ranged(which has worked pretty well) but you get my sorc in CC and its really kinda sad.

It would be nice to double up a sorc and Lucius, move them to him and then just beat them down. This will probably require some counts as games before I buy/paint the guy. Course if im looking for a straight up CC champ a DP with MoK+wings would be pretty beasty too. The real advantage there is that he DP has higher S/T but no real added bonus. Lucius could royally mess up an ork/nid charge by taking away attacks and hitting back on armor saves(perhaps I'm counting on my unusual luck for saves.) And that power sword will do some damage too.

My gripe with Abbadon is that he is so expensive and the chance of the 1 roll is pretty nasty. :wacko: Guess the only way to figure it out is to play a game or two and see how he rolls.

WarpWhisperer - August 12, 2011 09:30 AM (GMT)
QUOTE (Xaigion @ Aug 11 2011, 10:51 PM)
My gripe with Abbadon is that he is so expensive and the chance of the 1 roll is pretty nasty. :wacko: Guess the only way to figure it out is to play a game or two and see how he rolls.

I normally take him for 'a change' when I want a more relaxed game; all those points tied up in a 16% chance of failure doesn't really work for me on a regular basis!

Shadowblade - August 12, 2011 12:13 PM (GMT)
On the subject of Lucius, do your own models lose an attack as well when their bases are touching his? In his rules it states all models in base contact, there is no distinction between friend or foe... or I may just be messing that up royally :facepalm:
I wanted to use him as well for his awesomely low points cost vs. possible uses (anit-horde). I certainly wouldnt put him up against an army's elites, I have my own for that, I would just use him for his weedeating capabilities in which his stats are more than suited for to keep my other units from getting tarpitted too long.

Xaigion - August 12, 2011 03:09 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Shadowblade @ Aug 12 2011, 04:13 AM)
On the subject of Lucius, do your own models lose an attack as well when their bases are touching his? In his rules it states all models in base contact, there is no distinction between friend or foe... or I may just be messing that up royally :facepalm:
I wanted to use him as well for his awesomely low points cost vs. possible uses (anit-horde). I certainly wouldnt put him up against an army's elites, I have my own for that, I would just use him for his weedeating capabilities in which his stats are more than suited for to keep my other units from getting tarpitted too long.

I'm decently sure its only against enemy units, kinda like a flammer template. That being said I was thinking of using him to chew threw troops at objectives and whatnot so maybe he would be nice to have to those sorts of games. Play testing is definitely needed.

Kraytirous - August 13, 2011 04:22 AM (GMT)
Actually, a flamer template has in its rules that you must place it so as to get the most hits possible without touching an allied model other then the one shooting (as that is where the template is originating from).

There are similar situations in Warhammer fantasy (where base contact with allies is MUCH more common due to units being in blocks). For example, "all models in base contact may not use magical weapons." Unless it specifies enemy models or the FAQ says otherwise, it includes allied models.

Xaigion - August 13, 2011 06:38 PM (GMT)
Well, theres a simple way to work around that. Send him in first, with one round of pile in and then send in another unit the next round. Should keep the contact to a min.




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